Looking for practice material?

Find thousands of free archived packets for practice and study from the Quizbowl Packet Archive!

WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Tournament announcements, results, and discussion about specific tournaments.
Post Reply
User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

The Washington University Academic Team is excited to announce the fourteenth annual WUHSAC, to be held at Washington University in St. Louis on Saturday, January 28th, 2012.

I'm Gordon Arsenoff, and I'll serve as tournament director for this this year's tournament. The set is being written by WUAT, with contributions from Montgomery Blair High School in Washington, DC, and edited in chief by Charles Hang of WUAT and of Olympia Questions. Under Mr. Hang's editorship, we are already further along in completion of the set than we have been by this time in previous years, and we are looking forward to a tournament that will run more smoothly than ever.

To sign your team up for WUHSAC XIV, please e-mail me at deep.friar@gmail.com or reply here. Teams will be signed up on a first-come, first-served basis. The field will be updated in this thread as registrations are received. If the field fills up before you can sign up, please allow us to waitlist you as well; in such a large field there is an appreciable chance that one or more teams will cancel.

WUHSAC's format and rules will be similar to last year's:

Rules
  • 20 tossups and bonuses per game
  • no computational math
  • no negs
  • no powers
  • bouncebacks on bonuses
Format
  • Up to a 36-team field
  • Bracketed round robin prelims
  • Re-bracketed round robin playoffs
  • four-team superplayoffs and final if needed
Fees for the tournament will be as follows:
  • $10 per school plus $65 per team
  • -$5 per fully functional (eight-player) buzzer, up to $15 off per school
  • -$15 per experienced staff volunteer
This year, I'd like to ask everyone interested in staffing the tournament to let me know well in advance of the tournament, by e-mailing me at deep.friar@gmail.com or replying here. This will include both those volunteering on behalf of a school and others. Keeping track of staff for a tournament of this size will be almost as big a deal as keeping track of the field in preparation for the event. Thank you very much for your help!

As in previous years, we expect that some number of top-finishing teams at WUHSAC XIV will be invited to this year's PACE National Scholastics Championship, also to be held at Washington University in St. Louis, June 9-10, 2012. WUHSAC will provide a useful opportunity for teams and staffers to visit and become familiar with our campus and facilities before NSC.

If you have any further questions, please e-mail me or reply here. We look forward to seeing you at WUHSAC XIV!

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

Field (36/36)
  • Rock Bridge (3)
  • Villa Duchesne Oak Hill (1)
  • Clayton (3)
  • Chatham Glenwood [IL] (1)
  • Rockwood Summit (1)
  • Springfield [IL] (1)
  • Valley Park (1 team, 1 buzzer)
  • Webster Groves (1 team, 1 buzzer)
  • Oakville (1 team, 1 buzzer)
  • Parkway West (2 teams, 2 buzzers)*
  • Priory (1)
  • Parkway South (2 teams, 2 buzzers)
  • Savannah (1 team, 1 buzzer)*
  • Ladue (3)
  • Troy (1)
  • Notre Dame (1)
  • Helias (3)
  • Hancock (1)
  • Parkway North (1)
  • Jefferson City (1 team, 1 buzzer)
  • Fairfield Community [IL] (2)
  • Parkway Central (1 team, 1 buzzer)
  • SLUH (1)
  • Francis Howell Central (2)
Waitlist (3+)
  • Francis Howell (at least 1)
  • Eureka (1)
  • Pattonville (at least 1)
*Registration form received

Staff count: 23-30 (target 40)

Updated 1/11/11
Last edited by deep_friar on Wed Jan 11, 2012 12:29 pm, edited 23 times in total.

User avatar
scphilli
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by scphilli »

I am a clearly biased source on this but I must say that I am absolutely thrilled to be working with an individual of the caliber of Mr. Gordon Arsenoff on this project and feel that under his leadership and Mr. Hang's editing, we are going to provide a truly unique and singular event. I know some found last year's event a touch lacking, but the critique was heard, the changes were made, and we want this to exceed expectations. I hope to see you all there!

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

WUHSAC XIV will use WUStL Updates Statistics Live! for scorekeeping and stats. If you are interested in staffing WUHSAC, please create a free account and take the opportunity to practice using WUStL before the tournament. If you have any questions about the system once you get started, feel free to e-mail me or ask me here on the forum.

We used WUStL at our recent college event, GIT, and it enabled a really efficient, error-free event. All of our staff had had a little practice scoring games with WUStL during practice, and that helped quite a bit.

Coaches, please keep replying below or e-mailing me to sign up your school's teams! Thanks very much.

User avatar
PenforPrez
Posts: 817
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:00 am
Location: Not quite Baltimore. Not quite Washington, D.C.
Contact:

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by PenforPrez »

I'm glad to see Northmont coming back. I'm anxious to see how Sam Blizzard will do. In nearly 20 years in this business, I will honestly tell you I have never seen a better freshman than Sam Blizzard from Northmont (Sam played two years in middle school). This kid is the real thing.

I read several rounds for Northmont recently at the Tippecanoe tournament down in Dayton, which runs on an A-set, and the first round I read for Northmont, Sam went 5-10-1. He averaged 103 PPG, I think, in the prelims. Cleared the field by about 21 PPG. Wow. :o

djones
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:54 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by djones »

Glad to see a good, strong field in place. We look forward to coming out for this tournament again.

To follow-up on Paul's comments- first of all, thanks. Sam has really been an incredible player for a freshman and has far exceeded my expectations. We've posted some wins over some impressive teams this year, but given that he is a freshman who scores 90% of our points at most tournaments, he still has some big holes that have led to us losing some matches we probably shouldn't have as well. Given some stats I've seen, I wouldn't be shocked if we got pummeled by Ladue and Rockbridge (and others) on certain packets, but if he catches a good packet, he could give them a tough match. If he keeps at his current pace, he will be a monster in a couple of years- anything we do this year is just icing on the cake.

Looking forward to our first trip to Missouri in the snow and ice this January!

User avatar
scphilli
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by scphilli »

djones wrote:

Looking forward to our first trip to Missouri in the snow and ice this January!
Oh please don't say "snow and ice." There is a reason pharmacies run out of pepto in STL that week and it usually happens when I check a weather forecast.

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

The announced 36-team field has filled! We will begin admitting teams to the waitlist on a first-come, first-served basis.

Based on good response so far to the call for staff and the length of time until the tournament, I certainly would not rule out expanding the field if another bracket's worth of teams joined the waitlist.

User avatar
DeckardCain
Posts: 4472
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 12:00 am
Location: Viburnum, MO
Contact:

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by DeckardCain »

Can't remember if I told you yet or not but I should be available to staff this.

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

DeckardCain wrote:Can't remember if I told you yet or not but I should be available to staff this.
Awesome sauce. Thank you

Charbroil
Posts: 1039
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Charbroil »

Ladue wins WUHSAC XIV 570 to 120. Congratulations!

We have later mirrors for this, so please keep comments general. If you have more specific comments, please email me at charleshang228@yahoo.com

I am aware that there were quite a few issues with this set. Unfortunately, several of our writers chose to turn in less than optimal questions at the last minute (or not at all) and thus I was wrapped up in replacing those questions rather than editing the existing ones. We will be conducting additional editing before any mirrors.

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

As Charles noted: Congratulations to Ladue A, champions of WUHSAC XIV!

Full stats and standings are available at the links below.
Prelims: http://young-frankenstein.wustl.edu/sta ... ebreaker=0
Playoffs: http://young-frankenstein.wustl.edu/sta ... ebreaker=0
Superplayoffs: http://young-frankenstein.wustl.edu/sta ... ebreaker=0

Note that superplayoff standings include games carried over from the playoffs.

There were some discrepancies about round numbers, so only most of the games on the scoreboard are placed in the rounds they belong in.

Thanks to all the staff who turned out and made this run, including everyone involved in making sure we had a question set. Everybody did the work of two people.

Ameneses
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 11:59 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Ameneses »

What are the official rankings for those who broke to superplayoffs? Considering Parkway West A and my team, Clayton, both had to leave early, I'm curious as to how that impacted the results.
Last edited by Ameneses on Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Mewto55555
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 6:56 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Mewto55555 »

Ameneses wrote:What are the official rankings for those who broke to superplayoffs. Considering Parkway West A and my team, Clayton, both had to leave early, I'm curious as to how that impacted the results.

Ladue had 1-0 over Clayton and Rock Bridge 1-0 over Parkway West due to regular playoffs. Parkway West left early and so went 0-3. Clayton beat Rock Bridge, then left and said they would forfeit any future games, because certain members of the Clayton team, like certain members of the Clayton team before them, did not want to disappoint certain females by playing more quizbowl. Ladue beat Rock Bridge, so Ladue was 3-0, Clayton 2-1, Rock Bridge 1-2, Parkway West 0-3. Since Clayton forfeited the advantaged final, Ladue won, Clayton was second, Rock Bridge third, Parkway West fourth.

Thanks to everyone who ran this, I had a great time! A few of the questions were...interesting, but it was a marked improvement over last year! Also Gordon your stats program is really cool!

EDIT: Re: stats I can't access the scoresheets of individual games.
Last edited by Mewto55555 on Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
scphilli
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by scphilli »

I would also like to take a moment to praise Gordon for the stat program. I was kinda nervous using it this weekend, because let's face it, the July event didn't work too great. And I'm so trained at using paper for everything that I was reluctant to try new things. Well I found this to be incredibly straightforward, user friendly and actually a major time saver to use. Gordon, I know, personally has put a ton of time into that program in the last several months and for that he should be honored.

User avatar
Charlie Dees
Posts: 4134
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:00 am
Location: Columbia, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Charlie Dees »

Thank you to Wash U for again running a huge tournament. It was fun to see everybody, get your complimentary food and T-shirts, and play quizbowl. I want to congratulate Gordon and the rest of the staff on running a pretty good event logistically and giving us a chance to play some very good teams again. I also enjoyed finally seeing Gordon's stats program put to use, it's pretty cool to monkey around with, especially as someone who scorekept on it for one game.

However, I am not going to mince words about the questions, Charles has already pretty much stated the case that they were not good, and Max is being MOST charitable in his description. They weren't bad like old Missouri quizbowl used to be, but they are handily going to be the worst set played in-state all year outside of the MSHSAA series for teams like ours that prioritize MOQBA events. If I had the set I could probably make a giant post of specific flaws, but since I don't and that would bore me, I'd rather talk about something more systemic with WUHSAC to try and prod this event into the direction I would like to see it go in the future.

I'll start by saying something that Wash U people might be unhappy about. I don't think there has been a single WUHSAC set written that ever exceeded anything other than being semi-decent by standard pyramidal high school quizbowl standards. There are always plenty of individually decent questions in each set, but there are always lots of very poorly written questions that have misplaced clues, are biography bowl, are too hard, have factual errors, or otherwise just are lame, and make the overall experience one where teams who expect a high quality set are very frustrated. A lot of the problem is that WUHSAC mostly didn't attract those teams ever. Pyramidal quizbowl only existed in Missouri through WUHSAC for quite some time, and many teams didn't begin to really have a deep consistent understanding of good quizbowl until last season, long after lots of other places nationwide got into it. This is compounded by the fact that Wash U has rarely had strong writers with good editing resumes, had lots of peripherally involved players contribute questions that end up not being edited well enough, and the lack of consistently good teams clamoring for better quizbowl left everybody without a fire under their rears to do a better job the way everywhere else with good housewrites has done. Additionally, teams not knowing enough about how to judge the sets also meant they weren't really having the outcomes of their games be too unduly affected by the packets, meaning there would be less frustration over these problems (other than the usual nonsense complaints about long questions). When I played, I was so happy that I had any kind of pyramidal set in state that I was willing to play it, and even then, I still was a lone voice in the dark telling people things like "the set is too hard" and "there's too much biography nonsense." Since good quizbowl has emerged everywhere else, teams are coming to expect much better, and they can receive much better at most other events, meaning WUHSAC will be less and less relevant.

What's so disappointing about this is that a long-running consistently large tournament at one of the midwest's most prestigious universities, not to mention one that is so easy for so many teams to get to, should be able to attract the strongest field in the state. Top teams from out of state should be wanting to consistently attend this tournament and make it one of the year's most competitive events. Instead, the set drives these teams away. Nowadays, lots of teams have told me that the old WUHSACs on the archives are among the worst sets that they'll run into there, and I have been told by players on nationally competitive teams who have come to WUHSAC in the past they won't bother coming to WUHSAC because of the question quality. If you look at past attendance patterns, lots of great teams like Rockford Auburn, DCC, Walton, or Dunbar gave Wash U a year or two of attendance, then stopped coming. Carbondale won last year and chose to drive to a better tournament much further away at NIU today rather than defend their title here. It's very clear that something is going drastically wrong that my vision isn't happening after 14 iterations, especially after Wash U modernized their playoff format last year. The questions are nuking this tournament's potential.

In the future, it's abundantly clear to me that Wash U can't produce a set on their own that will be considered worth the money for a team to drive in and play. I would strongly recommend Wash U find outside editorial help, or mirror another set next year, and continue doing so unless something drastic changes and the culture of the team is one that is conducive to a housewritten WUHSAC being a success. This is all such a huge waste to me, because I know that there are so many sets out there that are good that Wash U could have run on today that would have been infinitely better, and there is no reason to have to produce a whole bad tournament by yourself when you can pay to have a good tournament. The quality of the experience for teams is what is most important in a successful event, not the satisfaction you get from your questions being used, and when one gets in the way of the other, something's gotta give or else the tournament will be an unfortunate experience. I would love to keep coming to WUHSAC, and I would love for it to attain it's true potential as a nationals-lite field, while also keeping the aspects of it that Wash U's team brings to the table like the shirts, the nice lunch, and the fun chance to see friends that make this tournament better. All that needs to be fixed now is the questions, and the solutions to this problem are so simple it's insane. Please, Wash U, please do something drastically different next year to ensure you have a great set with the same playoff format at all costs, because only then will your tournament be truly great.
Last edited by Charlie Dees on Sun Jan 29, 2012 11:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
scphilli
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by scphilli »

I don't disagree.
Last edited by scphilli on Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

Scoresheets of individual games aren't working all the way. One must be on the tournament staff to view them. By and by I'll figure out what's causing that, and fix it.

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

I'm kind of ready to concur with Charlie in regards to our institutional capacity to house-write a quality set (or the bulk of one). As a club, I think we kind of keep imagining that this will be the year we finally get enough dedicated, competent personnel to do a good job. That year just never comes. I think it's time we took stock of that before getting in over our heads again next year. There's so much good material out there. Wash U ought to make use of it, and contribute to it what we actually can, instead of taking on ourselves a bigger task than we know, as a group, we'll ultimately be able to do.

Several folks worked very hard to make sure we had what we had, but, unlike in staffing a tournament, in writing a question set it's not really possible for a few core people to work harder and make up for others who bail out very late in the process.

FishyFreshman
Posts: 501
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2007 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by FishyFreshman »

I agree with pretty much everything that Charlie said. Our writing system is pretty flawed.

I would like to sincerely thank Charles Hang for all of the work he put into the set though, and for making the best of the situation that he got put into. Most of the problems boiled down to the fact that a significant number of people either didn't write their questions at all (and never informed us that they didn't plan to), or turned in unusable questions mere days before the event. Were it not for the hard work of a dedicated few (especially Charles) in the few days before the tournament, the set would have been many many times worse.

I also want to thank Gordon for being a great TD, and all of the other staffers who worked exceptionally hard.

Charbroil
Posts: 1039
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Charbroil »

I (obviously) agree that we need to change our writing process for the better. If there is no way for us to improve that, then I would agree that it would be a good idea to consider not writing our own set.

That said, I do think we have the ability to write a good set for next year. For one thing, I would like to note the very real improvements we have made in the past two years. Specifically, we are now writing roughly 70% more questions than two years ago, notwithstanding the fact that the set my freshman year had something around 1/1 computational math per round. Moreover, the average quality of questions has, in my opinion, risen since then, the really bad ones notwithstanding.

In short, I think we have the potential to write a good tournament for next year. Since such a statement obviously demands evidence, my goal is that we'll have the set done significantly before the tournament so that third parties can evaluate it for themselves and pass judgment accordingly.

User avatar
Mewto55555
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 6:56 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Mewto55555 »

I really hope its better next year; I'll be pushing for Ladue to come back again if the question quality improves! :D

User avatar
scphilli
Posts: 2097
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by scphilli »

Charbroil wrote:I (obviously) agree that we need to change our writing process for the better. If there is no way for us to improve that, then I would agree that it would be a good idea to consider not writing our own set.

That said, I do think we have the ability to write a good set for next year. For one thing, I would like to note the very real improvements we have made in the past two years. Specifically, we are now writing roughly 70% more questions than two years ago, notwithstanding the fact that the set my freshman year had something around 1/1 computational math per round. Moreover, the average quality of questions has, in my opinion, risen since then, the really bad ones notwithstanding.

In short, I think we have the potential to write a good tournament for next year. Since such a statement obviously demands evidence, my goal is that we'll have the set done significantly before the tournament so that third parties can evaluate it for themselves and pass judgment accordingly.
NO. No no no no no. We cannot put together 16 rounds of real quality at the commitment level we currently have. We've tried that twice and it did not work. I am sorry (with all due respect) you worked hard but it came up like this. To constantly do something the same way and expect a different result is the definition of insanity.

User avatar
DeckardCain
Posts: 4472
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 12:00 am
Location: Viburnum, MO
Contact:

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by DeckardCain »

A series of terrible posts has been relocated to here

Charbroil
Posts: 1039
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Charbroil »

scphilli wrote:
Charbroil wrote:I (obviously) agree that we need to change our writing process for the better. If there is no way for us to improve that, then I would agree that it would be a good idea to consider not writing our own set.

That said, I do think we have the ability to write a good set for next year. For one thing, I would like to note the very real improvements we have made in the past two years. Specifically, we are now writing roughly 70% more questions than two years ago, notwithstanding the fact that the set my freshman year had something around 1/1 computational math per round. Moreover, the average quality of questions has, in my opinion, risen since then, the really bad ones notwithstanding.

In short, I think we have the potential to write a good tournament for next year. Since such a statement obviously demands evidence, my goal is that we'll have the set done significantly before the tournament so that third parties can evaluate it for themselves and pass judgment accordingly.
NO. No no no no no. We cannot put together 16 rounds of real quality at the commitment level we currently have. We've tried that twice and it did not work. I am sorry (with all due respect) you worked hard but it came up like this. To constantly do something the same way and expect a different result is the definition of insanity.
Sorry if I was being unclear--I'm not advocating WUAT writing 16 rounds next year, nor are we organizing the writing the same way as in the past. Obviously, we're making changes.
scphilli wrote:You are NOT a mod on this board. Kent can speak his mind if he wants.
I didn't notice that this board had the same rule as the national one about posting about other people posting (I only looked through the numbered rules and didn't give the material below more than a glance). My general apologies.

Online
User avatar
socalcaptain
Posts: 1495
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2006 12:00 am
Location: St. Louis, MO

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by socalcaptain »

Regarding set quality, having read most of the packets, I must say I was disappointed in the lack of simple, basic copy editing. I freely admit that I lack question writing experience, so I'm unable to provide any deep commentary on the structural issues of questions, besides noting that I saw a few clues that seemed too early and a few answers that seemed a little on the hard side, perhaps. From a staffing perspective, the set was hard to read - questions were not numbered, words were blatantly misspelled, I actually saw an instance of "witch" for "which", and there were answer lines which were woefully incomplete or actually incorrect.

Since I've already read most of the packets anyway, I would be more than willing to copy-edit the set, just so my fellow moderators at future mirrors do not have to endure a literal trudge through sloppy syntax and grammar issues. Please let me know if this is something you want my help with. (Hint: You want someone's help; if not mine, please please please find someone to do this.)

Charbroil
Posts: 1039
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by Charbroil »

socalcaptain wrote:Since I've already read most of the packets anyway, I would be more than willing to copy-edit the set, just so my fellow moderators at future mirrors do not have to endure a literal trudge through sloppy syntax and grammar issues. Please let me know if this is something you want my help with. (Hint: You want someone's help; if not mine, please please please find someone to do this.)
I'll keep your offer in mind.

User avatar
OakvilleHSCoach
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Sep 27, 2009 12:00 am

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by OakvilleHSCoach »

Could you please send an email to coaches when the stats are up and running? The links posted above do not show anything. I need the win-loss record for each round my team played and I am having trouble locating that via the link posted.

User avatar
christino
Posts: 159
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:16 pm
Location: St. Louis

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by christino »

This is probably what you're looking for (Oakville is 10th from the top). However, the scoreboard provides better detail, but both have errors (some schools are listed as having played 9 or 11 games when they played 10). There is no "team detail" page yet, if that's what you're looking for (at least to my knowledge).

User avatar
deep_friar
Posts: 33
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 12:43 pm

Re: WUHSAC XIV (1/28/2012) at Washington University in St. Louis

Post by deep_friar »

Charbroil wrote:
socalcaptain wrote:Since I've already read most of the packets anyway, I would be more than willing to copy-edit the set, just so my fellow moderators at future mirrors do not have to endure a literal trudge through sloppy syntax and grammar issues. Please let me know if this is something you want my help with. (Hint: You want someone's help; if not mine, please please please find someone to do this.)
I'll keep your offer in mind.
We also had a dedicated copy-editor lined up in Ammar Zahid. Had questions been available further in advance of the tournament, he'd have had a chance to do that job. I bet he would also be willing to contribute a pair of proofreading eyes in addition to Alex's.
Charbroil wrote:I (obviously) agree that we need to change our writing process for the better. If there is no way for us to improve that, then I would agree that it would be a good idea to consider not writing our own set.

That said, I do think we have the ability to write a good set for next year. For one thing, I would like to note the very real improvements we have made in the past two years.
We have indeed made big improvements in the past two year, but those did not mean that, as a club, we were any less doomed to fail. What they meant was that we were less obviously doomed to fail, which ultimately hurt us.

The process is very vulnerable to people burning out and not completing their material. We've never had an idea how to incentivize those who are going to write to do so on time -- not even me. We're not gonna come up with that idea this year, and we're not, in the offseason, gonna come up with the handful of additional Charleses it would take to make the current process likely to succeed.

In setting expectations for next year, it should be noted that I myself will not have time to write or edit any questions. The run-up to WUHSAC is simultaneous with the open season of the academic job market in political science, and, as a final-year grad student in 2012-2013, I will be completely occupied with that process.
christino wrote:This is probably what you're looking for (Oakville is 10th from the top). However, the scoreboard provides better detail, but both have errors (some schools are listed as having played 9 or 11 games when they played 10). There is no "team detail" page yet, if that's what you're looking for (at least to my knowledge).
Good navigation, Ben!

It's true that scoreboard has some errors, and that some teams are listed with the wrong number of games in any given phase. Largely, these are due to games being entered with the wrong round and phase numbers.

However, some teams did actually play fewer games than expected. Teams in two of the prelim brackets had only four in-bracket games each (plus one cross-bracket exhibition game) because we had only 34 teams instead of the theoretical 36. Also, teams who had playoff games against Valley Park or Troy did not get a full set of playoff games after those teams left early.

I can manually fix some errors in the database; I also have some all-new software ideas about how to help future scorekeepers avoid making these mistakes and about how to get game details displayed for teams and individuals. I'm sorry to say that these are sort of low priorities for me at the moment as I turn attention back to academic work for a while.

Post Reply